Welcome to FATT Chat! The acronym stands for Fat Acceptance Tales & Techniques and underlines the very intention for this series. The hope is to create fat visibility with first-person fat liberation stories, as well as foster fat acceptance in others by sharing fat positive resources and strategies. In FATT Chat, you’ll find interviews with NAAFA members and non-members alike who will share their personal stories of fat acceptance and the real life techniques that have and continue to help them in their own lives. You’ll also find all resources discussed in an easy-access list at the end of each interview.

With that, please enjoy this FATT Chat featuring Vanessa Chica!

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This interview was recorded on October 5, 2021 . Please enjoy the audio version below.

BREE: Yay! Welcome to another FATT Chat. I'm Bree. We're here with Vanessa, who is gonna introduce themselves. But if you haven't been here before, FATT Chat is all about fat acceptance. Well, it literally stands for Fat Acceptance Tales and Techniques because we share our stories for visibility, and we also share what has helped us empower ourselves through our own fat acceptance and fat liberation stories. 

So, Vanessa, why don't you introduce yourself. Let the people know who you are. 

VANESSA: Sure. Hi everyone, I'm Vanessa Chica. I'm an educator, poet, playwright, fat activist, allergic to dogs but I love them anyways, and I'm happy to be here.

BREE: Yay, thank you so much. Also, that's very unfortunate about dogs, but I'm glad to hear you persevere.

VANESSA: I can't have one in the house, but yeah. 

BREE: So, this is such a big question and there's so many times where it's, like, impossible to even tell the entire story probably, because this is, for a lot of us, a lifelong thing. But wherever you want to start and end, whatever you want to share, could you just talk to us a bit about your own fat acceptance story?

VANESSA: Sure. So, yeah, that's a lot to think about, and I'm gonna say that it's... There was never just one story, right? It's a bunch of stories and they're ever evolving because there's so much unlearning and learning to do. So, it's not linear, but to give you an example or a more recent example—I was in a virtual poetry event with other poets and the poet that got on before me, she's, like, huffing and puffing, and she goes, “Oh my god, I thought I was gonna get here late, but I ran up the stairs and I'm out of breath like a fat cow.” So, I'm like, “Oh, okay, I'm gonna wait until it's my turn and then I'm gonna speak.” So, I waited and then I said, “Hi, I'm Vanessa Chica. Words have power and anybody that runs up the steps is gonna be out of breath, whether they're fat or thin or in between. It's a normal thing.” Right? So, everyone just kind of, like, froze. And I'm like, “All right, I'm going to start my poetry now.” You know? And that's just something that I would have never done a few years ago. I was never vocal. I was just, you know, internalized everything. And now I’m speaking up, so that's one example.

BREE: What was going on a few years ago that got you starting to think about these kinds of things?

VANESSA: Just... Things are changing, right? Slowly, but they are changing. We see more fat bodies in the media and things like that. And also, my writing. I co-wrote a play with two other women and it was about… 

BREE: I'm so sorry, I lost you for a second. I think it's my internet. I'm gonna switch internets real quick and if for whatever reason it kicks us off we'll just rejoin. 

[Internet absolutely kicked us off.]

BREE: Just before we were rudely interrupted by the internet, the question was: What was going on a few years ago that made you start thinking about fat bodies in this different way? 

VANESSA: Right. So, just, like, changes are happening, even though they're happening slowly, they're still happening, right? We see more fat representation in the media and I just kind of got tired. I got tired of all the stuff that comes with the diet world and things like that. And I said, “You know what? Something needs to change.” So, I gave myself that space to be vulnerable in my writing and talk about my experiences out in the open—something that I would have never done before. Yeah. That's what's been happening, little by little, more and more changes.

BREE: Do you remember what it felt like the first time you shared publicly those kinds of writings?

VANESSA: Absolutely. So, I'm like, “Oh my god, I'm gonna do this. I'm gonna do it.” So, after I shared it I'm kind of like, you know, in my feels. Any time that I share anything vulnerable, right, my whole body responds to it. So, I'm kind of, like, shaking. And it was such a good response, because I got a lot of good feedback. Like, “Oh, I felt that too,” or things like that. So, I'm like, “All right, I'm doing the right thing. I'm speaking for those who haven't found the courage to speak for themselves yet, and maybe they will after they listen to me.” So, yeah, it was amazing.

BREE: Does it feel differently now?

VANESSA: It does, yes, absolutely. I'm a little bit more empowered. I'm not saying that I have days that I'm not how I was a few years ago, obviously. But for the most part, I'm a bit more at ease in my body, which makes things better.

BREE: Can you talk more about the play that you wrote?

VANESSA: Yes! So, it's a poetic play, so it's all poems, and it's about navigating the world in a fat body. It's three women, we co-wrote it. It was directed by my good friend, Peggy Robles-Alvarado. And we talk about, where does it come from? It comes from all over, right? When we're young, from our families, they don't know any better, you know. They have their own fatphobia, and then it gets carried on to us, and then we just continue moving forward. So, it talks about family, it talks about dating and relationships in a fat body, employment, traveling, going to the doctor—that's a big one. That's the one that I still struggle with, but now I’m definitely much more of a self-advocate. It’s just, in general, everything that we have to go through living in a fat body versus someone who's not. 

BREE: I love this idea of, like, writing about bodies with other people who may share the same experience. What was it like coming all together, the three of you. Like, what was the communal aspect and what was the writing process? 

VANESSA: I feel it definitely made us closer, for sure. We all had similar emotions, but the experience is in a different way, so the poetry was different. And I've definitely changed. I know they have definitely changed. I see it by what they post, what we talk about, you know. We're all doing this fat empowerment type of thing in our own ways, so it was a great experience and we're still working together. Actually, we have a four-year anniversary coming up in December. 

BREE: Yay! 

VANESSA: Yeah! And we're going to have an event where we're going to stream the play, because I have a recording of it, and have a Q&A. So, I'm looking forward to that for those who weren't able to see it before. 

BREE: Have you done something like that before? Where there was a Q&A? Because I’m curious what kinds of questions people ask in reaction to the play. 

VANESSA: Yeah, we did a Q&A at, uh... Because we had three or four sold out shows, which was awesome, and we did Q&As afterwards. And I mean, I got questions like… Well, not questions, more like comments. One person said, “You know, I have a daughter and I call her ‘gordita,’” which is chubby in Spanish. And she said, “I do it out of love.” And I’m like, “Yeah, I was called ‘gordita’ and I internalized it as something else, you know. Even though I know my parents love me, blah blah blah, still it paints a picture, right? And then when you go to school and they call you that, it's just, you know. Find something else. Find something else. My darling, my love, whatever. Find something else.”

BREE: Can you remember any other questions or comments?

VANESSA: Some some people said something like, “You know, I didn't know people lived that way or felt that way, because they're oblivious, right? They're not walking around in fat bodies, so they don't have a clue, right? They don't have the same needs that we do, so they don't know any better. So, I'm like, “Okay, that's good, that means that you'll be more aware.” Right? Things like that. I mean, it was a great experience. We didn't get any negative feedback, not to our faces. But whoever was there was definitely open-minded and supportive. 

BREE: What about in your personal life? When you started, like, advocating more publicly. I know for me, like, when I came into fat acceptance and fat liberation, I definitely started navigating the world differently. How was that for you and in your personal life? What kind of feedback or conversations were you having with people in your life?

VANESSA: Again, just being more vocal instead of just sitting there quietly. I'll give you another example. At work, right, everyone's sitting around during lunch, and I was having french fries. And a co-worker was looking at them and she said, “Wow, they look really good.” And I'm like, “Would you like some?” And she said, “No, I'm trying to be good.” So, I said, “Well, so what you're saying is that I'm being bad because I’m having the french fries?” And she's like, “Oh, I didn't mean it that way.” And I said, “I know you didn't, but it's just food. Either you want the french fry or you do not. It doesn't equal goodness or badness if you eat the french fry.” Right, that whole diet culture, you know. 

BREE: Oh my gosh, yeah, and in work environments too. Like, at least in my experience, work environments were the most toxic for diet culture and, like, that negativity. Like, that's all I feel like anybody talks about besides their job.

VANESSA: You are correct. Who's eating the pasta, who's not eating the pasta. Who gained three pounds. Who's... whatever. So, I have lunch at my desk. And I'm a school teacher, now I just have lunch in my room by myself, but it's quite all right. I'm at peace, I do what I need to do, and I don't have to listen to all the other noise, and that's what works for me.

BREE: Yeah, it's really important to have those kinds of personal boundaries, like, to separate ourselves from things that are just not gonna work for us.

VANESSA: I can't tell them, “Hey, stop talking!” Yeah, I do advocate, but if I'm walking around like, “Don't say this, don't say that.” you know, it becomes a little bit too much. So, I'm like, all right, you know, boundaries. I'll go to my room, I'll see you guys later, you know. You guys can have that diet talk stuff going on. 

BREE: What grade level are you teaching?

VANESSA: Kindergarten and first grade, special ed.

BREE: Oh! Young babies. Hmm, I guess I’m gonna assume…  [Zoom freezes] Uh-oh, wait, hold on, let me see if you come back to me… 

[It does not. The internet knocks us off again. Oh, the realities of virtual life.] 

BREE: I wasn't sure if I was gonna ask this and then it cut me out. And I was like, maybe I shouldn't, but I’m gonna do it anyway, I was assuming that little, little kids, like, this kind of stuff doesn't come up. But I also know, like, I've been fat my whole life, so fat has always come up. So, I'm just curious, as a teacher, has body stuff come up in your classroom at all? And what's it been like talking to those little kids about this kind of stuff?

VANESSA: All the time—because they have a fat teacher! I mean, they start noticing and they'll say things like, “You're big!” And I'm like, “Uh-huh, yeah, uh-huh.” Like, I don't make a big deal about it. I'm like, “Yeah, and you're small, and she's tall, and he's short, and we all have different bodies.” And they're like, “Okay.” They let it go. 

I did have a group of students, well, one particular student who came in mid-year and she was much bigger than the rest of the students. And I just knew, I was preparing myself because I just knew. So, you know, we're sitting around and we're doing the whole circle time thing, and one student says, “She's ugly.” I look at him and he goes, “Yeah, because she's really fat. So, I'm like, “Okay, control yourself.” And I'm like, “Well, you need to be kind,” and then I turned it into an entire lesson of us looking at our bodies and talking about our bodies and how are they different and how are they like. And I took it further, like, “What do we like to do? We have the same interest,” and things like that, just to create a little bit more understanding. Afterwards, I had to talk with him, just him and I, talking about being kind and why would you call someone ugly. What does ugly mean? What does that mean to you? What does fat mean to you? And after I spoke to him, I was under the assumption that this is something that happened at home right. I don't know if he has a fat family member or he's seen or heard fatphobia in his family and he brought it into the classroom. 

And the little girl, you know, she was just, like, the sweetest thing. Just looking. I spoke to her afterwards and I let her know, I said, “You know, he said you were fat and so am I. We're the same, you know?” And she looked at me and smiled and the whole year, like, I would just wink at her like we're friends, you know, just to make her feel good. Now she's in fourth grade and it's amazing, every time she sees me in the hallway she's like, “Hi!” But yeah, I think at that young, you should definitely start teaching that we all have different bodies and that's okay. 

BREE: I love that. I'm just thinking about what it would have been like to have a teacher or just another adult in my life as a kid who would advocate for me and themselves that way. That's not even a truth in my life and it brings tears to my eyes because it would have changed my life. 

VANESSA: For me too, of course. But right now we can make that difference. 

BREE: Yeah, absolutely. I know you've talked a bit about, well, a lot about speaking about bodies differently, advocating for yourself. What are some other strategies or maybe resources that you've used that empowers yourself in your body?

VANESSA: Yeah, so, I've bought all the books. All the books. I pulled them out. I have, Just Eat It about intuitive eating. What We Don't Talk About When We Talk About Fat. Fitness for Everybody. Come as You Are. Anything by Virgie Tovar. I read it all. Maybe some things I don't agree with, but it's okay I pull what feels good in my body, right. So, definitely reading. Talking with friends, you know, venting and talking and things like that. Social media. Follow everybody. Bodies that look like you, people who are on the same wavelength as you, just start putting all those bodies all over your IG so it feels good when you're scrolling and you see people like you. My friend Rebecca says, “All bodies can.” And we can! And seeing others do it shows us that we can. It gives us that boost, like, “Yeah, we can try that, and we can do it too.” So, those are the resources. Friends, social media, books, podcasts, all the things. 

BREE: Social media has absolutely been the through line of every interview. Like, the internet is a blessing and a curse but a blessing, for this specifically in terms of, like, visibility and finding other people on your wavelength. I know sometimes it's hard to remember everybody we follow, but are there any people that are kind of your go-tos or that you really look out for on social media?

VANESSA: Teacher brain. I don't remember… Oh, NAAFA is a good resource! I did a workshop with them and it was amazing. They give plenty of opportunities. I follow fat artists, fat illustrators, I buy art. That's another thing, I have fat art on my walls. Yes, I don't know their names right now. 

BREE: That's okay. I think it was Tigress, she gave very good advice on this and was like, “If there's even one person who you vibe with, go and see who they follow.” So, we're just gonna tell everyone to follow you and then go and look at everybody you follow.

VANESSA: I like that. Yes, follow me and it'll be awesome.

BREE: I love podcasts. Can you remember any of the podcasts that you like?

VANESSA: Today I listened to Joyful Movement. I don't remember the person's name. I think her name is Kim. But it talks about not exercising right. Not, like, “Oh, I have to do eight miles per whatever.” Just doing joyful movement. Like, I'm big on dancing or I have a VR (virtual reality) set that I love. And I’m moving that way or dancing with my students. Just, you know, not having these crazy exercise goals, but yeah. Joyful Movement, that's one that I heard today. 

BREE: I love talking about dance because it's one of the more recent tools I've acquired in terms of, like, feeling empowered in my body. And it's still, like, a “thing” for me. Like, I only been dancing in pandemic, so alone, and I really don't know if tomorrow I had the opportunity to go dance in public, if I would. What has your relationship to dance been like?

VANESSA: Many, many moons ago, I was in a dance group and we used to dance in festivals and parades. So, I've always loved dancing. It's something that I love to do. If I'm in public now, I mean, I do a two-step, I don't go all crazy. I don't do that anymore. But I do enjoy the music and our cultural music. Like, dancing merengue and salsa. I bring it into my classroom every day. We're dancing every day.

BREE: I love that! Do they like it? 

VANESSA: They love it! I have one, as soon as he sees me, he's like, “Freeze dance?” And he keeps saying it until we walk all the way upstairs. I'm like, there's your freeze dance. 

BREE: That's so cute. What about... I mean, all of this is totally self-care stuff, but are there any other, like, self-care or maybe emotional wellness sort of things that you've utilized?

VANESSA: Yes. So, there is a Facebook group called Caring for Our Fat Bodies. It’s amazing. All the resources that are in there, you know. You have a rash? Go in there, someone will tell you about it. 

Self-care... Wearing clothing that fits. Getting rid of clothing that does not fit. Wearing things that feel good to you, right, that feels good on your body—not because you want to look a certain way, but that feels good. 

I like makeup. I like doing stuff to my hair. Vitamins, you know, eating a well-rounded meal, whatever that may be to me that day. If I feel like eating something, I'm gonna eat it, I don't restrict, because restriction just creates more disordered eating. That's been my experience, so I don't do that. So, self-care is eating what you feel like eating that day. Writing is my self-care. Writing my emotions out. I mean, I've been writing since I was a kid. I had a dear diary type of thing. 

BREE: I heard you have a new book. Is this true or is it somebody else?

VANESSA: Well, I edited an anthology of over 50-something writers. That was definitely an experience. It's a it's a Latinx anthology. 

BREE: Oh! Can you tell us a little about it?

VANESSA: Yeah. It's titled, What They Leave Behind and it's over 50 poets just sharing their poetry, you know, about their ancestors and their experiences being Latinx. It was my first experience editing a book. I learned that I don't want to be an editor. [both laugh] That's what I learned. I'm super proud of myself, but it was very time consuming and very stressful. So, editors are amazing and they should get paid all the money. But I love the book. I love what I did. I love what people submitted. The cover is amazing. I hired a friend named Nia Andino to do the cover, so she painted this awesome painting and it's the cover. 

BREE: That just reminded me of how you said you have fat art around your house. And I know this is, like, now not a linear conversation, but whatever. That has been one of my favorite things to surround myself with, like, images of fat bodies. I think that's the same reason why finely curating our social media to represent what we want. [Vanessa shows a fat painting behind her.] Oh, I love it! So cute.

VANESSA: Don't ask me who the artist is because I don’t remember right now.

BREE: It's okay. If I showed you mine, I'd have to say the same exact thing. Yeah, that is just so important. Because if we can't see it, if it's not just kind of already there from what gets provided to us, then we have to do it ourselves, right? Kind of the same thing goes for, like, advocating for ourselves and everything too. Are there any other kind of fat positive things that you try to surround yourself with or participate in?

VANESSA: There's tons of YouTube stuff going on. Oh wow, my brain… I should have wrote this stuff down. I mean, if you start searching, you're gonna find it. It's out there. Look and search and you will find it. We're fortunate that there are things now. Not like how it was before. So, it's there. And if it's not there, then maybe create it! Get some friends, make it happen. 

BREE: Yeah. And so much of it is virtual, even before pandemic. Like, I know for me, my fat acceptance story started on Tumblr. That's where I learned that fat positivity was even a thing. I'm wondering though, because I'm itching to get back to some in-person stuff. Do you know of fat positive community over on the East Coast in New York?

VANESSA: So, there's Fat Girl Hiking. It's all over. Me and my friend Christine are ambassadors for New York, but we haven't started anything in person just yet. 

There's tons of stuff here, it's just kind of been on hold for now. But that's one that I know from the top of my head, since I'm an ambassador. But there's a site, it's called meetup.com, and you can probably find like-minded people and and make groups too. There's a roller derby group that I heard of also, if you're into that stuff. 

BREE: I actually play roller derby! 

VANESSA: I think it's badass and I think it's cool to go look at, you know, but I am not too good on skates. But there's tons of things going on here. 

BREE: Yeah, roller derby is so cool. It's, like, one of the few places where I found that, like, literally there is a place for every body type in it. Like, my body type has benefits on the track that other body types don't and it's, like, there's so few places where that is true. And it was one of the most empowering things to realize and also just to realize that I can do it. Like, I remember watching Whip It when it first came out. Have you ever heard of that movie?

VANESSA: Yes. 

BREE: I watched that movie, like, over a decade ago or whenever it came out, and I literally was like, in my head being like, “This is so cool. It's a bummer I'll never be able to do it.” And when I did do it, I was like, even though I had even already been in fat positivity and stuff for maybe five or six years, I still had these ingrained beliefs. Now I've been skating for 10 years and it still blows my mind to like do these twirls and shit, that I'm just like, I can't believe my fat body. Like, now I can believe my fat body does it, but like, I love seeing other fat people see me do it. Like, I remember at one of our last practices, there was a fat person kind of off to the side watching. And I have no idea what they were watching or what they were thinking, I don't want to assume they feel any type of way about themselves. But for some reason, I just felt very strongly that it was very important that we were both there in that moment witnessing each other, you know what I mean? It's a really fucking big deal. So, yeah. Anybody who can see roller derby, go do it. It's dope. It's a really precious community. Like, there's not a lot like it, I think. 

There's also Chub Rolls, have you heard of Chub Rolls? It's in the Bay Area right now. My fingers are crossed that they will have factions in other areas. But it's a fat skate community and it's just for fat people. They have skate sessions and they teach people how to skateboard and roller skate and it's literally only for fat people. Like, if anyone who's not fat comes, they have to be a guest of a fat person, because they want it to be a fat space. 

VANESSA: I love that, because we can't just go into any space, right? 

There's also, um... We hosted one a few years ago, like, a fat pool party event. 

BREE: Yes! 

VANESSA: We've done that too, and there's other people doing it also. 

BREE: So, what was that like for you, going to an event like that?

VANESSA: I mean, we hosted it, so, we rented a pool, some person's full pool. And it was... I'm just gonna say, I felt at ease. Because any time I would go to a public pool or something and you're in your bathing suit, there's always something, right? There's always someone looking or whatever, you feel a certain way, and that day I didn't feel any other way other than just going to the pool, you know, which was pretty amazing. We need to feel that way in every space everywhere we go. 

BREE: Was that the first time you were in an all fat space?

VANESSA: As in in a pool? Yes. In our bathing suits, yes. Besides bathing suits? No. We've done the Fat Girl Hiking and things like that. It's been years ago, but there used to be a BBW meetup where you'd go to a nightclub and, you know. So, yeah, I've been in spaces like that. 

BREE: Can you remember what your first one was like?

VANESSA: It was at that nightclub and it was… It was odd. Just because it almost felt like the men that were there were there to, like... Maybe we were some kind of fetish or something. It actually, to me, it felt kind of like a meat market type of environment. I'm like, “Oh my god, they're all staring at me,” you know. So, I didn't frequent that place because of that. I'm like, “This is not what I want,” right? So, that was odd. 

BREE: What was the first one that wasn't weird like that? 

VANESSA: It was the hiking. So, the woman who created Fat Girl Hiking, her name is Summer. She traveled, like, she got in a van and she traveled all over the states trying to open up more chapters. And when I found out she was coming this way, I'm like, “Oh, we gotta go meet her! We have to go meet her!” And we did and we went hiking. I have some kind of anxiety over exercise. Anytime I'm gonna go exercise, it's always all this anxiety for me. It's never like, “I'm just gonna go hiking.” It's always like, “Am I gonna be fast enough? Am I gonna…,” you know, all the self-talk. And with her, it was a beautiful experience. Like, her motto is like, “I'm the slowest one in the back.” So, she stays in the back and she just hung out with me. And she's like, “Oh, I have these walking poles.” And I'm like, “Whoa, this is cool!” And she's like, “Here, borrow them.” And we just hiked and I didn't feel that anxiety that I always get. So, after that she asked if we wanted to be ambassadors and I'm like, “Absolutely! If I can provide this kind of feeling to someone else, yeah I want to do that.” 

BREE: Do you think it was simply holding the space for that that made you feel safer?

VANESSA: Yes, and seeing other bodies like mine hiking. When you go hiking with other people, they're like, “Okay, we're gonna hike eight miles in 3.5 seconds,” and I'm like, “Damn, can I just enjoy nature?” You know? And [Summer’s] like, “Whenever you want to turn back just tell me, we'll turn back.” And that's exactly what she did. I hiked for a while, you know, and then I said, “Okay, I'm ready,” and she’s like, “Let's go.” You have no stress. That was pretty cool. 

BREE: I love that. I'm also obsessed with van life too, so I love hearing that that's kind of where she started. That's really exciting. Because I go down YouTube rabbit holes about that kind of stuff all the time and I very rarely see fat people. And even my partner was convinced at first, like, that kind of stuff's not for fat people. Like, fat people can't live in a van and blah blah blah. And it's kind of made me low-key, like, I need to do it to prove that it's possible. 

VANESSA: She does it! I asked her, I said, “Is it hard?” And she's like, “You know, sometimes it's a little scary depending where you are and you just have to be careful. You have to be aware of your surroundings.” But that's what she did. You can do it too! I don't want to do it because I like the bathroom. I'm a little bougie, I think. But I'm impressed of those who do it. Like, my friends are like, “Let's go camping in a tent!” I'm like, “Uh, I will take a cabin, thank you. You can sleep in a tent on the floor.”

BREE: Yeah, you're a glamper. 

VANESSA: I feel like I am. It's okay to be a glamper. 

BREE: Absolutely! This is definitely only a recent interest of mine, so we'll see if I'm actually suited for it.

So, in every FATT Chat we have a question from the previous guest. Before we get to that final question, I wanted to ask you what you would like to ask the next person who gets interviewed in FATT Chat.

VANESSA: I thought about this. So, the question would be, “If you could give a bit of advice to someone who is struggling, what would that be? And can we be friends?”

BREE: Okay, now you actually get to answer your own question. 

VANESSA: Ah, yeah. For me… Give yourself grace and space. Find your tribe, people who will support you. Look for resources, they are there. Read. I almost feel like once I started looking for things, they started to find me. Once I was open to them, they just keep coming because I'm open to it. I'm like, “Yes, I'm gonna be a fat activist,” and things just keep coming. Opportunities keep coming. So, I guess just be open and take that first step. That would be my advice. 

BREE: Are you your own friend?

VANESSA: Most of the times, yes, yes I am my own friend. Absolutely. 

BREE: Well, I'll be your friend too.

VANESSA: Thank you!

BREE: Okay, so, the question from our previous guest was my very good friend Trevor Kezon. He asked, “What would your dream fat representation in media be?” I think Trevor's answer was, like... Oh wait, maybe this was my answer. Well, somebody said, like, a fat Sex in the City or something like that.

VANESSA: One of them could be fat and not just a funny single one. She could be the main one. She could be Carrie.

Dream fat representation… It will be all types of fat bodies, not just the [does air quotes] “acceptable” ones, right? The ones with the flat tummies and small waists and big butts and all that. It would be all types of bodies. All shapes and sizes. That would be my dream representation. And them playing the main characters, the people who do fall in love and not just a funny fat person on the side. That would be it.

BREE: So, it would be a show or a movie? 

VANESSA: It should be everything! There should be shows, it should be movies, there should be news anchors. I mean, if we want to do it, we should be able to, right? We don't have to look like one thing. Look at the news. Everybody kind of looks alike, you know? All bodies, please. 

BREE: I think that was the best answer. Fat people everywhere in all the things, period. 

VANESSA: Period. That's a shirt! I'm gonna make it, let me write that down.

BREE: I'll be your first customer. 

VANESSA: I am really writing it down. 

BREE: As you should! 

Well, that was the last question. Is there anything that we didn't talk about that you feel very strongly about speaking on before we end? 

VANESSA: I think we covered a lot. I think I'm good.

BREE: Cool. Where can we direct people to find you? Where would you like people to find you and your work? 

VANESSA: IG @vanessachicawrites or you can come to my website vanessachica.com. 

BREE: That’s where they find the book and the play information? 

VANESSA: Yeah, that should be there, yep yep. Definitely come to the event. I haven't seen the play in a while, but I think it's worthwhile to see it.

BREE: For sure. When is that happening?

VANESSA: December 4th, it's a Thursday. We're gonna screen the play and then do a Q&A afterwards. It's still a few months away, but it's on my website, so you're able to pre-purchase tickets.

BREE: Perfect. Yay! That's so exciting. Well, thank you so much for sharing everything you shared 

VANESSA: Oh! I have one thing, I remember now... [lifts sleeve to show a large tattoo on her upper arm] Do you see it?

BREE: Oh, yes! I think I actually saw that you posted it recently, right? 

VANESSA: Yeah. So, I have this obsession over all things big. Elephants, whales. And that's what I'm doing. I'm getting anything that's big all over on one side of my arm.

BREE: So, tell the listeners or the readers what is the one you showed me and what is the other one? 

VANESSA: Sure. So, it's a super huge tattoo on my left arm of a humpback whale surrounded by monstera leaves, which are also big and beautiful. And there's also an elephant tattoo on my forearm.

BREE: I love that. Are you gonna get any more? What is your next one? 

VANESSA: I think so. I'm not sure. This one was kind of painful, so I'm still kind of like, “Yeah, no.” But maybe. I don't know.

BREE: Yeah, it's pretty big. I have an infinite list of tattoo ideas, of course, but I think it'll be my first, like, kind of fat one. Other than, I do have a tattoo of Divine, who's a fat drag queen. But I really want to get an ice cream cone, and I want each scoop to be a fat animal. So, maybe, like, a little piggy scoop, a little cow scoop, maybe a little elephant scoop on a little cone. So, that's cute, let me manifest that. 

VANESSA: Awesome, I love that.

BREE: All right. Well, thank you again, Vanessa. It was so lovely to chat with you. I can't believe an hour's pretty much flown by. 

VANESSA: Likewise. Thank you!

***

The FATT List!

All items are listed in alphabetical order.

Communication

• Call out fatphobia in everyday life and advocate for fat positivity.

• Speak up about diet culture and value judgements around food. There is no "good" or "bad" food!

• Talk to kids about body diversity!

  • When fat is commented on, Vanessa usually responds, "Yeah, and you're small, and she's tall, and he's short, and we all have different bodies. She continues, "I think at that young, you should definitely start teaching that we all have different bodies and that's okay.”

  • When fatphobic comments are made, she turns it into a lesson for the kids. She explains, "I turned it into an entire lesson of us looking at our bodies and talking about our bodies and how are they different and how are they like. And I took it further, like, 'What do we like to do? We have the same interest,' and things like that, just to create a little bit more understanding.

  • Vanessa also explains how to speak 1-on-1 with kids who make fatphobic remarks. "[We talk] about being kind and why would you call someone ugly? What does ugly mean? What does that mean to you? What does fat mean to you?"

  • Support the kids who are receiving fatphobic comments. Vanessa talks about relating to them and explains, "I spoke to her afterwards and I let her know, I said, “You know, he said you were fat and so am I. We're the same, you know?” And she looked at me and smiled and the whole year, like, I would just wink at her like we're friends, you know, just to make her feel good."

• Talking with friends, venting.

self-care

• Adorn your body with tattoos. Vanessa loves getting tattoos of things that are big, like elephants and whales.

• Clothing as self-care.

  • Wear clothing that fits.

  • Get rid of clothing that does not fit.

  • Wear things that feel good to you, that feels good on your body⁠—not because you want to look a certain way, but that feels good.

• Engage creatively with other fat folx. It creates your own fat positive community and support network. Plus, the work your produce can help others.

• Explore your experiences as a fat person through creative writing.

• Explore your emotions and experience through journaling.

• If you're struggling…

  • Vanessa says, "Give yourself grace and space."

  • Read fat positive works.

  • Find your tribe of people who will support you.

  • Seek fat positive resources. Vanessa explained, "Once I started looking for things, they started to find me. Once I was open to them, they just keep coming because I'm open to it."

• Facebook group called Caring for Our Fat Bodies

• Fill your home with fat art.

• Find types of movement that bring you joy. Vanessa loves to dance and play with her virtual reality set.

• If there's diet culture happening in your work environment, especially at lunchtime, it's totally okay to have your lunch somewhere else. Vanessa eats at her desk. Bree used to eat in their car with a podcast.

• Self expression through makeup and hair.

• Sharing your fat positive creativity (or even just your thoughts) in public is empowering! It helps others too.

• Vitamins and eating “well”, whatever that means to you.

Media

• Anything by Virgie Tovar

• Curate your fat positive social media! Vanessa says, "Follow everybody. Bodies that look like you, people who are on the same wavelength as you, just start putting all those bodies all over your IG so it feels good when you're scrolling and you see people like you."

• Come as You Are by Emily Nagoski, Ph. D.

• Fitness for Everybody by Meg Boggs

• Follow Vanessa on Instagram @vanessachicawrites and her website vanessachica.com.

• Joyful Movement podcast

• Just Eat It by Laura Thomas

• Live Big Girl - poetic play by Vanessa and two other women.

• What They Leave Behind edited by Vanessa! A Latinx poetry anthology

• What We Don't Talk About When We Talk About Fat by Aubrey Gordon

Community & Events

• Fat Girls Hiking - body positive hiking community

• Live Big Girl 4 Year Anniversary Virtual Celebration! Thursday, December 2, 2021. Screening of the play, followed by Q&A. Buy tickets here.

• Seek out fat positive meetups on meetup.com.

• From Bree: Skate communities are great for body positive community.

  • Lots of roller derby leagues are body positive, and fat bodies are essential on the track!

  • There's also Chub Rolls, a skate club for fat people based in the Bay Area.

Miscellaneous

• NAAFA!

Bree XVI (they/them) is a NAAFA member who likes to help people in the ways they know how. They provide collaborative emotional and spiritual support and resources through their venture Bree is Helpful AF. A lifelong writer, they also enjoy playing music, making art, and petting every cat that will let them. Born and raised in Philadelphia (Lenape land), they now reside in Los Angeles (Gabrielino-Tongva land) with their partner and succulent garden.

OPINION DISCLAIMER:  Any views or opinions stated in the NAAFA Community Voices Blog are personal and belong solely to the blog author. They do not represent the views or opinions of NAAFA or the people, institutions or organizations that the owner may or may not be associated with in professional or personal capacity, unless explicitly stated. Any views or opinions are not intended to malign any religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, or individual.